User:MuppetArchives/Current Events 13 (Sept-Oct 2006)

Archive of Current events discussions.

Adoption Category
Just wondering --- what's going on with the Adoption category? When I load the category list, it shows up in red, but it says that it has 5 members. And when I click on it, it shows there being five articles in it, but it also says that the page is a preview and has not been saved. It's really... bizarre. George B. ''(talk ) 01:19, 12 September 2006 (UTC)


 * All fixed. — Scott (talk ) 01:25, 12 September 2006 (UTC)


 * Just for the record, George, it's not bizarre. That's what happens when category tags are added to pages before the category is created, and then the person in question forgets or gets busy or otherwise never actually creates the category. The same effect happens when existing category titles are misspelled or formatted, thus categorizing the page in a new, non-existant category. -- Andrew Leal (talk ) 03:14, 12 September 2006 (UTC)


 * Oh, I see. How curious. Okay, thanks for the info. George B. ''(talk ) 03:25, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Song ID
I've added a new section to Muppet Wiki:Still Stumping. — Scott (talk ) 16:28, 11 September 2006 (UTC)

Performers
Justa a heads up. We've talked about finding better ways to make categories accessible to newcomers. One thing which has helped is grouping related categories into a broader, easier to remember heading, like Characters, Merchandise, and International. Anyway, prompted partially by a discussion with Julian (who wasn't sure where to find German puppeteers), I've just done the same, creating Category:Performers, under which can be found Actors (for on-camera performers, and I've included Performer Cameos as well), Puppeteers (for Muppet performers, Muppet puppeteers, Creature Shop puppeteers, etc.), and Voice Actors. I'll probably add in Celebrities later on (though I'm half rethinking myself on that, since some celebrities' involvement had nothing to do with performing in Muppet/Henson productions). Anyway, hope this simplifies things, and if I missed any categories, feel free to add them in! -- Andrew Leal (talk ) 05:05, 9 September 2006 (UTC)


 * That's a great idea, yay! My feeling is don't put Celebrities into the Performers category, but the other stuff yes. -- Danny (talk ) 13:25, 9 September 2006 (UTC)


 * Yeah, the more I thought about it, that seemed problematic, and besides everyone knows where to find Celebrities. It's one word. However, the precise phrasing on some of the others can sometimes be hard to remember, or in some cases, users aren't even aware the category exists. -- Andrew Leal (talk ) 14:20, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

Animal Jam Episodes Help?
I just found out that I get Discovery Kids, which airs Animal Jam still. The magic and wonder of TiVo will allow me to get any and all episodes that air, though its not at my apartment, so I can only work on it when I go home for weekends and stuff (which works out okay, because I'll just hit the updates hard on those weekends). My question though, is that I haven't been able to find a site that lists the airing order, so even though I have episode titles, I can't order them 101 and so on (was it 2 seasons? I'm not too familiar with the show, but since I get it I'd like to learn). Anyway, I just wanted to hear thoughts as to how I should input the episodes without this information, or see if anyone has an order that I can detail accordingly. Thanks all. --Cantus Rock 21:43, 8 September 2006 (UTC)


 * That's cool, I'm glad you're getting them! If they've got episode titles, then maybe we'll just use those for now, and put in episode numbers later when/if we find them. But just having the episode names up would be a good step. -- <font color="Blue">Danny (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 02:26, 9 September 2006 (UTC)


 * Yeah, another beauty of the mighty TiVo is the pretty decent info they give you on the guide menu, which includes titles thankfully (as far as I've seen they don't list titles in the credits, though they do give song titles, which is another excellent plus. It seems like a very managable series to work on). I've already got 2 down, I should have about 4 or 5 before I have to leave again. Should I just make articles with the title (ie. "A Hug A Day" as the title) and categorize them as for now? --Cantus Rock 03:48, 9 September 2006 (UTC)


 * Yeah, that's great. Maybe as you watch them, you might pick up some differences that would at least help to figure out which ones are season 1 vs season 2 (if there actually were two seasons, which I dunno). -- <font color="Blue">Danny (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 13:24, 9 September 2006 (UTC)


 * Cool, I'll get started on the ones I've got recorded then. I'm hoping that Discovery Kids airs them in order and that there is a distinguishable first episode (which is usually the case for both). That way when the series loops, I can figure it out that way and organize accordingly. :) --Cantus Rock 13:40, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

Wikipedia Links
Not a major issue, but a pet peeve of mine that I thought I'd mention. Wikipedia tags. , are used on a lot of pages for celebrities, actors, and references (for characters and Muppet performers, it's generally agreed upon not include Wikipedia links, since if our page isn't better than theirs in those areas, it should be). I'm fine with that, but sometimes such links are added and the page just doesn't exist. Either it hasn't been created, or the link goes to someone else with the same name, or to a redirect (on Wikipedia, Charlie McCarthy redirects to Edgar Bergen, and that page has less info on Charlie than we do!) Not a big deal, easily fixed, true, but it crops up often enough that I thought I'd mention it. The easiest way to prevent it is, when adding a Wikipedia link, especially for a semi-obscure subject or fictional character, is to preview the page first, and click the link. If the page doesn't exist or its the wrong person, take it out.

And a related tip, especially for our newer members. If Wikipedia *does* have a related page, but it doesn't have the same title as ours, or the link goes to a disambig, use this format. Carry on! -- <font color="Blue">Andrew Leal (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 00:45, 5 September 2006 (UTC)


 * Actually, looking at what links to Wikipedia, maybe it's worth discussing in general. I've found a lot more puppeteers and Sesame Street cast members' pages include Wikipedia links than I thought. I know Danny and I discussed it with Nate long ago, but I can't find it, and I don't know if it was in current events or in a talk page or user page where it went basically unnoticed. I don't want to yank pages if others think they're useful, though I did pull a few where the Wikipedia page either a) copied us or IMDb and offered little else, b) was a one line stub, or c) ABC-DEF-GHI‎, for which there's no real reason to link to Wikipedia that I can see. It seems to me that the purpose of linking to Wikipedia is to offer more information on a topic. Thus, since most of our entries on celebrities are either one or two lines or just some biographical info but with the major focus on their Muppet relevance, it makes sense. Same goes for things like China or fairy tale figures like The Big Bad Wolf or Prince Charming, where we only focus on one depiction of them. And with someone like Ron Mueck, whose career branched out beyond the Muppets, and where Wikipedia's page covers aspects of their life and work that don't really fit in here. But I'm not really sure there's really a point in Wikipedia links for Eric Jacobsen and Bill Barretta. In the discussion which I can't find, Nick said his hope was that someone would click on the Wikipedia link, see the stub or lousy page, and try to improve it. That's fine sentiment, but Wikipedia's bigger than us and doesn't exactly *need* our linkbacks, and while editors are naturally free to help out Wikipedia if they like, I'd rather we focus attentions on improving Muppet Wiki. So basically, in addition to my earlier points (and I removed a few faulty links), I'm in favor of limiting Wikipedia links for the Muppet performers, most major Sesame cast members, Gerry Parkes, and folk like that, as well as on Muppet productions and songs. We have some Creature Shop links too, but a lot of those, where the Shop was basically an effects house, we've given short-shrift too, just focusing on the Creature Shop credits and involvement, so I see a benefit to that. Thoughts? -- <font color="Blue">Andrew Leal (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 01:38, 5 September 2006 (UTC)


 * I completely agree. I wish I could add more in order to add extra weight to my agreement, but you said everything that I would want to say. I think on pages where our version is more complete and informative than Wikipedia's, we should take the Wikipedia link out. -- <font color="Blue">Danny (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 19:47, 5 September 2006 (UTC)


 * I do think that Celebrities (not Muppet cast like Sonia Manzano or Richard Hunt) should all be linked to Wikipedia, if only because I like the consistency. -- <font color="Blue">Peter (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 13:36, 6 September 2006 (UTC)


 * Oh, sure. Like I said earlier, it's only core-Muppet style people, and pages where the Wikipedia page is non-existent etc., that I'm concerned about, which is why I mentioned those. Celeb wikipedia links are useful. So I guess we're in agreement there. -- <font color="Blue">Andrew Leal (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 14:39, 6 September 2006 (UTC)