User:Toughpigs/Talk Archive 08

Archive of Danny's talk page.

deleting redirects
Hey, just a heads's up... we should check to see what links to a redirect before deleting it. I just had to correct a couple of broken links associated with a redirect you deleted for The Cat's Play Pals. Just so's ya know. -- Scott (talk ) 03:30, 8 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Oops, sorry -- I wasn't thinking. -- Danny (talk ) 03:35, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

first names
Hey, I forget: when we were talking about first names, we agreed not to do it for Jim Henson and Frank Oz, etc, but did we say it was okay to do it for guest stars? Figuring that that's the way they're addressed in the episode. -- Scott (talk ) 01:10, 8 June 2006 (UTC)


 * I don't remember if we mentioned it or not, but yeah, I think that's what we should do. Essentially, for the purposes of an episode guide, the guest star is a character on the show, so we refer to them by their first names. However, if there's a note discussing anything behind the scenes -- like "Nureyev wanted to dance a ballet number with Miss Piggy" -- then I think it should be last name. -- Danny (talk ) 01:56, 8 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Yeah, I agree. I just wanted to make sure we were all on the same page. -- Scott (talk ) 02:08, 8 June 2006 (UTC)


 * I'd just like to add that I agree also. It's first name usage on behind the scenes or bio pages that bugs me. When dealing with guest stars in episodes, MuppetFest, or even a detailed analysis of an audio commentary, say, should that ever happen, first names make sense, because those are by their nature informal, semi-fannish works. But on Harvey Korman's article page, it should always be full name or surname, not "Harvey," and same for performers (I've been working on it gradually; Jim Henson needs the most work, but it needs some expansion in general anyway). Andrew Leal (talk ) 02:11, 8 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Yeah. I did an overhaul of Muppet Show Goofs the other day; it was all Dave and Richard and Jim. It sounded all wrong. We admire these people, and we like their work, but they're not our friends. -- Danny (talk ) 03:18, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

UK Fraggles
Hi Danny, Ive fixed all the dead links around the UK Fraggle pages. I uploaded an image of the UK Gobo puppet and was wondering if you could add it to the Gobo Evolutions page. I tried but it seems to be locked, So I just put it on the Gobo page... But you took it down. Id much rather it be on the evolution page --Warrick 18:10, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Excellent, I'm glad you added those pages. I've temporarily locked the Evolution pages, until we can figure out a way to structure them better. I could add the UK Gobo, but honestly, I don't see much of a difference between that puppet and the North American one. The picture you uploaded is kind of distorted, too. Could you try taking another picture and not cropping it? Just do the whole screenshot. -- Danny (talk ) 18:57, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

Image:Dynamite1981.jpg
Hey, Danny, you might want to edit Image:Dynamite1981.jpg and smudge out your address label, just for personal privacy reasons. =) LtPowers 15:25, 5 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Ha, I didn't notice that. Well, it doesn't matter. That was where I lived in 1981. If anybody tries to find me there, then good luck to them. -- <font color="Blue">Danny (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 15:36, 5 June 2006 (UTC)


 * I just edited it. Whoever lives there now probably doesn't want to be bothered either. -- <font color="Blue">Scott (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 15:38, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

Groucho Marx
Hey, I'm watching the Spike Milligan episode and taking down some notes, and noticed that Spike does a Groucho impression in his scene with Sam. I was going to add it, but it would seem that you haven't started an article yet. I thought I'd leave it up to you as you're most qualified. I did a search and there seems to be plenty of other references, but I'm sure you can find more. -- <font color="Blue">Scott (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 23:34, 4 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Oh, that's great! I've been waiting for a reference to come along; I knew we'd find one eventually. Why don't you create the stub, with the reference -- and a picture, if you can take one -- and then I'll fill in everything else later. Hail Freedonia. -- <font color="Blue">Danny (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 23:36, 4 June 2006 (UTC)


 * I didn't know you were still waiting for a reference. Well, for either you or Scott, don't forget the ubiquitous presence of Groucho glasses (in The Great Muppet Caper, Fraggle Rock episode about the Poohbahs, etc.), and there's a presskit quote on Grouch Mayor saying the character's design was based on Groucho. <font color="Blue">Andrew Leal (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 23:40, 4 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Alright, you've got it. -- <font color="Blue">Scott (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 23:50, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

Who Done It
Not sure how you're going to pull off the reference qualification, though possibly a Muppet Mention, but here's another Dr. Who actor for you: John Barrowman. <font color="Blue">Andrew Leal (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 04:36, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I got that all sewn up. In the second episode of the new season, the Doctor tells Rose that he's bringing her to 1979. He mentions The Muppet Movie as one of the attractions, and says, "I love that movie!" I've been collecting connections for a little while -- I just need to get the exact quote to make the page. Zoe Wanamaker is another connection, she's been on the new series twice.


 * And bless you for creating the Barrowman page; I was so tickled when I clicked on it and found you'd already created it! -- <font color="Blue">Danny (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 04:38, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Yay! I just added another one, Richard Wilson. My favorite connection thus far is Peter Hawkins, though. I mean, we have a Dalek and a Cyberman in our database now! <font color="Blue">Andrew Leal (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 04:52, 2 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Nice! Good catch. -- <font color="Blue">Danny (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 11:43, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

I Love Liberty
Hey, do you still have those notes for I Love Liberty? The way you scribbled away, I figured you might have wanted to use it here.

Also, I can't remember exactly what Gonzo was wearing, but I think it may have been this. What do you think? -- <font color="Blue">Scott (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 02:08, 2 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Yeah, there's still stuff in that notebook that I haven't added yet. I got distracted and forgot about it. Duh. I'll add that stuff in soon... I don't think that's Gonzo's costume from I Love Liberty. I think that's a later promo shot for something else. -- <font color="Blue">Danny (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 02:57, 2 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Hm. What do you think of this one? -- <font color="Blue">Scott (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 03:08, 2 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Also, I can't wait for your notes on ILL. I kept the Piggy parts out for you to do as that better fits into the narrative anyway. -- <font color="Blue">Scott (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 03:09, 2 June 2006 (UTC)


 * I know, I'll do it tomorrow. That's a great picture -- I have no idea if that's the same costumes. -- <font color="Blue">Danny (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 03:09, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

The Complete Henson Database Website
I saw you commented on the validy of this site on Name That Puppet. I looked around that site for about 10-minutes and found its not reliable at all. In my short time surfing the pages of the "database" I discovered more than a dozen mistakes on performers, character names and who's in what productions.

For example: their Emmet Otter cast list includes Charlie Woodchuck and Harvey Woodchuck (I pretty sure they're a muskrat and beaver). They say that "the shouting lady...dances with Herman in every 'At the Dance' segments in the first season of 'The Muppet Show'" (when she actually dances with Herman in only four 'At the Dance' segments). The page for a character they call "The Jim Henson Farmers" simply says that "On the first season of 'The Muppet Show', there used to be two Muppet farmers with beards made to resemble those of their performer Jim Henson. They were called The Jim Henson Farmers. There was one who sang 'Put Another Log on the Fire' and another one who sang 'Nobody's Business'"

The website doesn't cite any sources (such as episodes) for things like where the characters' names came from (many of which I'm sure they just made up and present as official -- because we've found contridictions to a lot of their information here on the wiki). Nor do they cite how they know the performer of a silent background character (or who was puppeteering a dubbed character) – I think they try a process of elimination of the performers in a scene (but sometimes that fails). I think whoever runs the site goes off fuzzy memories and the fan lore, and makes a lot of assumptions about things and presents them as fact. (Plus I also saw a lot of stuff taken right off other websites - image-for-image / word-for-word - including bad info from Wikipedia and imdb.com). This site further builds up these erroneous notions and names that float around the fan base, come from seemingly no backable source and just won't die. I would recommend that we not use it as a source for information on the Wiki (such as character names, performers or facts). -- <font color="Blue">Brad D. (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 09:48, 1 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Excellent, I'm glad you looked around there! That's a good thing to know. I'm happy that we're working here to make sure that we have sources for everything. It's good to be the reliable source. :) -- <font color="Blue">Danny (<font color="Blue" size="1">talk ) 13:00, 1 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Yeah, before that website was created, Muppet Central started it's Muppet Show episode guides, where many characters with unknown names just got made-up description names for the guide (mainly in the section that listed all the characters who were voiced in the episodes), and kermitage began and released a character guide, which, as has been said at the Wiki, had quite a few errors and made-up names for unnamed characters, and the database just went by what names were included in these two sites. --Minor muppetz 17:06, 1 June 2006 (UTC)