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"It will happen"

Nick posted a source for this article today and put it in the Celebrities and Sesame Guest Stars categories. His edit summary was: "Enough waiting. If it doesn't come to happen after all this promotion, SW will have egg on its face. It will happen."

I'm glad Nick found the new article, but it still needs to be in the In Development category. Things always stay in In Development until they actually happen. There are plenty of things that were promoted heavily and didn't end up happening -- America's Next Muppet, for example, or (let's face it) Power of the Dark Crystal. Egg ends up on face. Things (don't) happen.

Even things that we're absolutely 100% sure are happening, like A Muppets Christmas: Letters to Santa, stay in the In Development category until the premiere. Even if it's going to happen, it hasn't happened yet. -- Danny@fandom (talk) 20:11, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

Ha, while I was writing this, Andrew moved it out of In Dev, saying: "we don't label people as "in development"; remove speculation on Season 40 if we don't know yet"
I think people can go in In Dev too, if they're talking about something that hasn't happened yet. Essentially, the page isn't about Gervais; it's about Gervais' appearance on Sesame, which is In Development. -- Danny@fandom (talk) 20:14, 31 January 2009 (UTC)
"but it still needs to be in the In Development category."
Are you saying that suddenly this article is okay, so long as it has a {{dev}} tag? There's technically no more guarantee it will happen than there was in November. The only development is that he's written a song for the presumed episode.
This was partially provoked by the stalled season 40 guest discussion at talk:Adam Sandler. We've got a photo of his appearance, and a talk show mention of it courtesy MuppetVJ, but not yes or no of whether he can have an article. -- Zanimum 20:23, 31 January 2009 (UTC)
Regarding the dev tag, we had that issue with Kanye West's article. -- Zanimum 20:23, 31 January 2009 (UTC)
I think the development tag looks bizarre and confusing. And the page will, or should be, about Gervais, although of course the appearance is the hook. We have one old less than reliable source, and a newer one which cites as its source an online entertainment tabloid. Earlier, Nick mentioned that there was something about it on Gervais' website. Googling around, the quote isn't actually on his website (if it was, it's been deleted, archived, or Google's just not finding it), just copied. So I agree with Danny about not wanting to seem too certain, but I also don't like the In Development tag. Frankly, it's all so spotty, I still think the best approach is park as we find here. When something *solid* surfaces, then it's worth a page. We have nice new pictures of, for example, Adam Sandler with sources direct from Sesame Workshop and a clear context for these as appearing next season, and they don't have pages yet. Don't wait for a yes or no in those instances, Nick, or feel aggrieved if you don't get a response (there's a talkpage logjam right now, if you'll notice, with a ton of stalled discussions in general; it's nothing personal). But, as a general policy when it's just a couple of text mentions from iffy websites and nothing solid, I think waiting to start a page makes the most sense. I think having a person in development is confusing and off putting in a way that it's not when one comes across Power of the Dark Crystal, but double checking some things just now, the sources are still very iffy even for a development article (remember Talk:Britney Spears?) The more I look at it, the more I think at least a temporary delete or redirect to the talk page and info parking is the best approach. Don't take this personally, Nick. You've found some great stuff and I'm glad you keep on top of Sesame things. But waiting for more solid sources or the actual thing to happen isn't a bad thing. We'll have more to say at the time and we can be sure of what we're saying about it. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 20:32, 31 January 2009 (UTC)
I think the Development tag is fine on a person -- it marks it for us as a page to watch. Kanye West is a really good example -- half of that is written in future tense about something that (presumably) happened in mid-2008. Andrew took the dev tag off in April, and then we forgot all about it. -- Danny@fandom (talk) 20:41, 31 January 2009 (UTC)
Looking at the Kanye West thing, I'm reminded of the original issue, which was that the tag was included on a person, with a redlink for the actual relevant *project* in development which had a name. I think that was and should remain a definite no no. In this case, we don't know what the project is. So I could possibly be persuaded on the tag thing, but really, if we're this uncertain, when it involves people, I still think info parking works. It's also because we have routinely created pages for Sesame guest stars *when we have solid info they're appearing*. Specifically, Sesame Workshop press pictures or video clips, without waiting for the actual episode to air, since Sesame's a pretty unimpeachable source (and they're also less likely, on the whole, to release info before they're ready). It's when we use passing online references or a picture floating around without real context that we run into trouble. I'm not sure it makes a lot of sense to tag every Workshop confirmed guest star where we have a picture and so on until the day that episode airs, but I also don't think we need to jump the gun when we really don't know anything. I'm still recuperating from a severe cold and lack of sleep, so I hope that makes sense. If we have to go the "in development" route for people, it would make more sense to do it as a general list, but in this case, I'm not sure we have enough for that. If it is filming in February, in theory, more will surface then, but Season 40 remains speculation and, barring a detailed interview directly with Gervais which is not just reporting what another website said and passing around the same quote, I honestly think waiting and info parking here makes the most sense. There's plenty of other stuff to add and work on in the meantime. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 20:45, 31 January 2009 (UTC)
Yeah, that totally makes sense. If the In Dev tag doesn't work, then I think info parking is the way to go. -- Danny@fandom (talk) 20:57, 31 January 2009 (UTC)
Now that I think of it, the best place for it is the Season 40 article. That's already in Dev, and it doesn't mention Gervais yet. That way, we get to have the info and the source on the wiki, in a place where we'll keep an eye on it. -- Danny@fandom (talk) 21:05, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

Not worth mentioning yet?

Ricky has mentioned on his website that: "I’ve been asked to do Sesame Street - there are some things you don’t turn down." Since they asked him, and he says that he wouldn't turn it down, and he isn't some D-rate celeb like Kimya Dawson, is that enough to create a stub article on him? Or I presume we wait until we here he's filmed it? -- Zanimum 15:30, 15 November 2008 (UTC)

Once again, it's better to wait until we have details. It doesn't matter how famous the person is, since we don't know what or when or where (an episode? A special or video? Next season or a couple seasons from now?) When there's something solid beyond being asked and not turning it down, then a page can be created. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 17:17, 15 November 2008 (UTC)
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