Lately, it seems that the Pajanimals has been getting more coverage here than other post-2004 Henson projects. With full descriptions for episodes, merchandise, and credits, frankly the page is pretty long and drawn out, even more so than Sid the Science Kid. With that said, I think the info on the Pajanimals page should be condensed, and whatever's eliminated here can be moved and expanded on The Pajanimals Wiki.
I don't know if we need to condense it. I've been grouchy in the past about giving post-2004 Henson projects more than one page, usually to eliminate the need for categories -- Pajanimals Characters, Merchandise, etc.
The Pajanimals page is incredibly long, but do we really care, as long as it all stays on one page?
I'm personally with Danny here. As long as it's one page coverage, it's not really a problem. Right now, the episode synopses and stuff are the right length (yes, more than we give Sid, but on par with Mopatop's Shop) and pretty useful, maybe slight adjustment (or something like a table; a lot of it is organization that makes the page look ungainly, with the credits showing up before the episode list, and the two crew lists could be merged with parenthetical "shorts only/full series" denotations or something when needed, as it's repetitive). It's stuff like portions of the character list (I'm thinking of the "unknown voice/mentioned only" ones) that could be trimmed, and the full credit transcriptions exceeds our own standards for what we consider "primary" interest credits, so trim those a bit or park on the talk page and maybe condense the "Songs" section.
That Pajanimals Wiki was started in 2010 and then promptly abandoned, and any real content on it is there because Jonathan just created it. If we want to port everything over that way, that's fine, but it should also be discussed with the user who's done the most work, Professor Tofty (aka George, our previous Bear in the Big Blue House expert; at one point I thought some other user was him returning, as I had encouraged him, when he used that same "Professor Tofty" nick in a Wikia chat over the summer while Wikia was at Comic-Con, to consider returning to contribute). It's only fair and he's followed the rules we set, so while I do think some polite trim suggestions or even just doing so in those areas is fine, I kind of don't like just telling him "Here, go copy it all over to another Wiki" unless he actually prefers the idea (although as a pro, it would allow for the solo pages which we're discouraging, but could also feel pretty darn lonely; even when you're the main or sole contributor to a page here, there's other stuff going on, and he's been contributing to other areas of the Wiki and to the community threads).
Admittedly I don't want to see things get too carried away, and to some extent I might be more exacting if this was for Dinosaur Train (which has no Muppet connection and is animated in India), but even there, a basic episode list or character list would be harmless (right now, that page looks like too many pictures).
Yeah, I agree. I made some changes to the Pajanimals page -- moving the credits list down to the bottom, and unlinking the names of performers who haven't worked with the Muppets & were unlikely to get their own pages.
Yeah, Dinosaur Train, ugh. At least Pajanimals has clear Muppet roots and not just "Let's stick the Henson name on something" (I hope they stopped the Possibility Shop at least).
Anyway, I just took a first stab at credit consolidation. Still looks a bit messy and may still drop a couple of fields (I'd like to make the puppeteer/puppet shop credits a little easier to pick out), but that gets rid of the repetition, trimmed folks like accountants and catering firm, and generally helps. It also allowed me to spot a couple of "Hey wait, these people *do* have legit Muppet credits and pages already" instances, which was harder with the other list.
The thing is, the existing rule is that as long as we covered all related info on one page, it was fine (this was when we were getting 20 plus Sid pages). We've already trimmed the page so it looks better. So I'm really not sure about the concern. Take out more credits? And I'd be fine personally with dumping the stage show bit, something that just looks clumsy, as does the international licensing stuff, all added in this edit.
I mostly see even less value in porting it all to an abandoned Wiki, which nobody had edited for over two years until today, with Jon adding the first real content as part of this discussion/experiment (and again, I think it only fair that if we do, the person who'd been expanding it be involved in the conversation).
I have to agree with Andrew. The page is looking better now, and there isn't much of a point to moving what little we left out to another Wiki (which, even with my contributions, probably won't attract anyone to help edit).
Hi, weighing in! I'm fine with how the page is now, so as long as there isn't any other major trimming, I don't mind. I was aware that this is Pajanimals Wiki, but I had decided really not to bother because, as has been noted, because it was, well, dead, and I wasn't really interested in trying to take over another wiki. Jbrang, if you're interested in doing more with that wiki and/or becoming admin for it, then I'm certainly interested in coming by to help out. I certainly like the series well enough to feel that it deserves a good wiki of its own.
Oh, on a sidenote, the episode order that I've been using for Season Two is the broadcast order on NBC Kids, which is apparently different from PBSKids Sprout, which it seems premiered Season 2 in August. Wikipedia (which is copying some of our material, including some that's been removed) lists what is apparently the Sprout broadcast order. Should we switch to that?
For our purposes, we don't have to copy Wikipedia (especially if they were copying some of the nonsense added by blocked users as well, as is their tendency). It's not a huge deal so I'd say go with whichever seems most practical to you, unless you find an official site episode list (which is typically what we've done in other cases).
I'd say, in that case, let's stick with the NBCKids order for now. Sprout's broadcasts are just too difficult to verify-- they don't ever list episode titles in their schedule listings. It's a bit annoying, but I can't say that I blame them. I think they tried it once, not long after they stopped coding listings as simply "The Goodnight Show" or "The Sunny Side-Up Show" and I suspect it drove them mad because it only lasted a week or two. With the way they air each individual story, they'd have to code the information for perhaps more than twice what a normal network does.